User talk:Clarinet Hawk/Archive 7

Vandals
'''Please list the names/IP's of potential vandals here. Also, if possible, tell me the page(s) they vandalized so that I can verify the claim and assess the damage. Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 02:20, 28 June 2008 (UTC)'''

This guy was vandalizing at around 10:50 to 11:00 ET (don't ask why I said that). I undid his edits, but seriously, why does everyone have something against ParaGoomba?  Mario Galaxy  A Galaxy begins anew... 04:05, 7 December 2008 (UTC)

This guy vandalized on Dec. 8, soon after the day changed on Smashwiki clock...  Fried beef  1    Ho ho ho!   01:12, 8 December 2008 (UTC)
 * And hurry! This guy's making spam articles like crazy every minute!  Mario Galaxy  A Galaxy begins anew...  01:12, 8 December 2008 (UTC)
 * You're damn right I did. THis is fun you little nooblets.
 * Man, this guy's fast. I'm reporting to the rest of the Sysops, K, C. Hawk?  Mario Galaxy  A Galaxy begins anew...  01:14, 8 December 2008 (UTC)

Get this guy as well, thanks.  Fried beef  1    Ho ho ho!   01:34, 8 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Wabble doesn't need a block. --Sky (t · c · w) 03:11, 8 December 2008 (UTC)

CHawk, this guy needs to be warned about the use of the wiki. Read the article he made. -- Toon Ganondorf CHAT  03:59, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, I'm going to have to ask you to ban Tedmasterlurkzorz. He keeps puting stupid comments on my talk page, and when BNK, Sky and I warned him, he told me that it is not likely that he will make a decent contribution to the wiki. His defence was "tell me i'm the only one". Can you get rid of him? He's really starting to annoy me.  Toon Ganondorf ( t    c ) 21:31, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

UR MR GAY is back with his wacky antics. Fun. Also, this. ''' METEORITE (t) 11:00, 19 December 2008 (UTC)

K got mad that we took out the unnecessary information about "crew releases" from their crew article and therefore he keeps vandalizing ours by removing information. Shade 487  z  23:35, 20 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Don' ban K, simply protect the page at Shade's revision.  Blue Ninjakoopa  Happy Holidays 23:40, 20 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Vandals are vandals are vandals? --  Shadow  crest  23:58, 20 December 2008 (UTC)
 * User:L33tSilvieMustDie  Blue  Ninjakoopa  01:03, 30 December 2008 (UTC)

Not to sound like a fanboy, but...
...whatever happened to Part 3 of the SmashWiki movie? Also, there's some stuff to be speedy-deleted. Miles ( talk)  21:39, 4 December 2008 (UTC)
 * and am i in it? Mas ter man  What's the matter?   Scared?  21:42, 4 December 2008 (UTC)

Life came calling and the movie is on a hard drive of a broken computer. We will be able to get it, but it's going to take some time. Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 21:51, 4 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Can you make me look like a turtle?  Koopa [[Image:Koopersshell.gif|19px]]  Klaus  21:52, 4 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Gotcha, C-Hawk. Miles ( talk)   22:25, 4 December 2008 (UTC)
 * So, Clarinet Hawk, what do you think of my prediction?  Koopa [[Image:Koopersshell.gif|19px]]  Klaus  11:15, 5 December 2008 (UTC)

orly? You're the fanboy? Who left the unanswered "You rock" on his talk page?  Baltro [  talk  ] 23:58, 5 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Referring to my prediction of the next tier list, me, or Baltro's... er... uhhh... song?  Koopa [[Image:Koopersshell.gif|19px]]  Klaus  06:31, 6 December 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for putting me in Smash Wiki teh movie. I just gotta give it up to you. BTW, I'm in caps lock. Try typing normally in CL. It's fun. Para Goomba 348 19:15, 19 December 2008 (UTC)

Apology
Hey listen, idk if you have da time to listen to me but, I'm really sorry about the way I acted 3 weeks agos. I just didn't know that you were helping me! You see, I'm an overreacting guy, I really overreact cuz I really have bad trust issues. I never trusted you from da start, but now I realize that I made a GIANT mistake. So i'm very sorry! Will you ever forgive me?? Squallinoa 08 (talk) 01:36, 7 December 2008 (UTC)

You are an admin
and I am a user who needs help. What are the most pressing matters on this wiki to be edited? What needs to be done? and is there a page for all the policies?User:DCP
 * Policies should be in the community portal, or you could just search in the SmashWiki namespace. As for things that need to get done, We're still trying to tie up the loose ends on the Brawl Character pages.  Just make sure they are all in the same format.  The ones that you should be referencing them against are Falco (SSBB) or Meta Knight (SSBB).  Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 04:44, 8 December 2008 (UTC)

Ouch
That one hurt.  Baltro [  talk  ] 04:38, 8 December 2008 (UTC)

Picto-quotes
Do we keep them or not? I need to know nao plz.  Koopa   Klaus  06:35, 8 December 2008 (UTC)
 * At the present, I'd say no considering they're not topical to this wiki and are doing nothing except taking up space and wasting resources. Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 16:13, 8 December 2008 (UTC)

Help Me
I noticed you deleted my archive page. However, there are a lot of other archive pages. Can you help me make a better one? SapphireKirby777 (talk) 14:01, 9 December 2008 (UTC)
 * All I deleted was the pointless redirect. Not the actual archive.  Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 16:10, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

It's k, I told him and fixed the link on his page. I'm Alex25, King of Randomness! Say Hi to me! Random stuff, Mah boi! 16:19, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

Chiding ahoy.
I'm dropping by to give you a little bit of chiding for either a) ignoring RFA or b) taking an excessive amount of time to decide the cases there. You were made a bureaucrat for a reason. A week, maybe two is an appropriate time to leave an nominee hanging. A month or more is not. --Sky (t · c · w) 22:23, 10 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Decisions will be made within the next 24 hours. Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 23:11, 10 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Thank you! --Sky (t · c · w) 02:35, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Just asking
What did you edit on my user page? (Just curious....)  ~Teh Blue  Blur~ ... ~Gimme the emeralds!~ 15:58, 11 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I got rid of the annoying fake message bar on the top. Check my archives to see why.  Oh, and you can always use the diff button to check, or use the history to compare pages.  Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 15:59, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Ah, sorry... I understand, i wouldent like that i suppose. It would be annoying. Am i allowed to put "Just kidding" next to it? (I'm not trying to be a snitch so sorry, pm, but he (i think its him) but has one too linking to something external...) Anyhow, sorry.  ~Teh Blue  Blur~ ... 16:04, 11 December 2008 (UTC) (Sorry about the signature, i'm gonna fix it now.)

vandalism
Go to Mewtwo and look at the "Gender" at the top part. I'm Alex25, King of Randomness! Say Hi to me! Random stuff, Mah boi! 23:18, 11 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Done, but why did you need me to do it for you? Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 23:33, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

Too much data on the page for my phone to handle. I'm Alex25, King of Randomness! Say Hi to me! Random stuff, Mah boi! 23:37, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

There is a user posting "this is not spam" repeatedly on my talk page. Someone who's seen my userpage and knows my real name... I've left it like that for evidence  Ike's Best Buddy Merry! Christmas!! 

Trophies
Do they all get their own pages? I'm planning a project on them, so I want to make sure I'll be doing it right.  Cheez person  { talk } stuff ''' 04:56, 13 December 2008 (UTC)
 * We have no official stance on that right now. The status quo is yes, but I wouldn't mind seeing that change.  Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 03:51, 17 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Do they all honestly need articles? The last thing I want is for this wiki to end up like the Mario Wiki (not wikia, the one powered by media wiki), as they have articles on the littlest things, including non-Mario related characters.  Blue Ninjakoopa <font face="Elephant"> Happy Holidays 03:52, 17 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Go here for my full stance.  Cheez person  { talk } stuff ''' 04:49, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

RfR's
Hi CHawk. Just thought I'd let you know that some of the RfR's could probably be closed. Cheezperson has 8 supports and no opposes, Gutripper has 10 supports and no opposes, and Blue Ninjakoopa has a whopping 18 supports and no opposes. I think that perhaps at least those three could be granted maybe. Just thought I'd let you know. -- Toon Ganondorf    (t    c)  22:51, 18 December 2008 (UTC)

Smasherbeta
Mind if I make my own version? Not on the template page. Can I make a sub-page stemming from my user page for it? You know, like User:Shadowcrest/archivebox, or any of his other subpages? It's kind of what I did here. Is that alright for me to do?  MarioGalaxy Talk 01:35, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * If you don't have time to respond, or you simply don't want to, it's okay. I'll just ask Miles.  MarioGalaxy Talk 01:38, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * In cases like that, I don't see the need for the separate page. It would probably be easier to just add the raw coding into your user page.  That said, it's one of the more legit subpages I've seen recently.  Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 14:57, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I don't follow the last part. What exactly do you mean by "legit subpages"?  Mario Galaxy Merry Christmas from the Comet Observatory! 03:34, 23 December 2008 (UTC)
 * What I mean is that while I don't think it is absolutely the best solution, it is better than some of the pointless subpages that have been cropping up. Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 03:37, 23 December 2008 (UTC)
 * You mean like "Luigi club", "Guest book", and the like? Wait, so you're saying that it's not completely necessary, but it's technically an OK subpage to have?  Mario Galaxy Merry Christmas from the Comet Observatory! 03:39, 23 December 2008 (UTC)

Question about machinima
Hello Clarinet Hawk. Now, I don't know if this topic has been debated or argued over, mainly because I didn't really start contributing to this wiki until a short time ago, and I don't really have the patience to rife through countless pages of archived information. However I do wish to ask as to why there is no page for machinima. I originally started to create it, but I found it had been deleted on July 9 by Silverdragon (or something like that). I would just ask them, but they are apparently on vacation or something, so therefore I ask you, because you were the first person on the admin list. I do believe it would be a relevant page to the wiki, if it had maybe a short history of Smash Bros. machinima, or a listing of machinmas with an explanation of their plot.

If this cannot be fufilled, then may I request a page be made for certain well-known machinmas, because as of right now, only The Last Tier War, Smashtasm, and The Wrath of Giga Bowser have their own pages. Now know that I am not bearing ill will towards those machinima, but I feel other machinimas like, Peach's Slutty Adventure, Wolf's Retarded Mission, Brawlgasm, and Smash Fighter should have their own pages as well.

Please respond posthaste as to this matter. Thank you for hearing my arguements and reasoning. IrvThaSol (talk to me)
 * What I think would be best is to get a single page called machinima and discuss it as whole.  We will then put the actual content over on the fanon wiki with links on the page here.  This is the same thing I'm going to be doing for the fan games.  Give me a week to get home and it will all be taken care of.  As for now, if you want to make the machinima page with basic informaiton on what it is and a list of the famous smash macinimas, that would be great.  Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 21:05, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Alright, I created the page, but I never have created one before, so I'm not quite sure if I got it right, so I classified it a stub. I need to put in a few more machinimas I guess. ....What's fanon wiki? IrvThaSol (talk to me) 12:37 23 December 2008 (Eastern)

Texture hack
It's pretty popular amongst smash hackers nowadays. What they do is take the texture of characters/stages/items and change the colors to be practically anything. An example is turning Wolf into Vegeta. These guys are the primary ones out there. If you want, I'd be more than happy to write an article on it but I wanted to get approval first so it doesn't end up being deleted. Shade 487  z  03:47, 23 December 2008 (UTC)

Quick Deletion for This page
I was searching through pages and i saw This page, and i saw it had speedy deletion at the top of the page.

i was thinking that it would be best if you/some other sysop deleted the page because im sure some people (younger people like 9 or 10) might see it, and will be influenced by it.

anyways, have a merry chrismas and hope that that page is "speedily" deleted =d

 Ssbb legend Is in!  TALK ·  EDITS  00:39, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
 * There's a category for pages like that, and admins usually check there to find pages that are vandal/joke pages, so you don't need to alert a sysop everytime you find a page like that. Smore King  Hap py Holidays!  00:42, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Costume Galleries
AS per the post merge cleanup, I was putting the Pallet Swaps(or costume galleries, as the PMC states) into the character articles, but Blue Ninjakoopa kept reverting my edits and said that those belong only on the Pallet Swap pages. Could you help out in this little argument? Smore King  Hap py Holidays!  15:31, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
 * SmoreKing, all you need to do is let me know where to find this post merge clean-up thing, and I'll agree. Just don't put in the image without a frame and center it, or it will make the article look like crap. <font face="Elephant"> Blue Ninjakoopa <font face="Elephant"> Happy Holidays 15:36, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Showed you this before...I called it Pallet Swaps instead of Costume Gallery. Smore King  Hap py Holidays!  15:38, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Palette swap is fine, just put it in a centered frame. lol I've uploaded moar images than you <font face="Elephant"> Blue Ninjakoopa <font face="Elephant"> Happy Holidays 15:41, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

lol no
My internet connection is far better than you think, and is certainly not worse than yours. <font face="Elephant"> Blue Ninjakoopa <font face="Elephant"> Happy Holidays 23:26, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
 * You don't have T1. I know this because it's not a residential connection.  We may have douchebags eating our bandwidth up downloading porn, but it is a highly advanced connection.  Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 23:43, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I don't, but how would you know? Is it something specially made for the building you're in? <font face="Elephant"> Blue Ninjakoopa <font face="Elephant"> Happy Holidays 04:44, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
 * As I said, it's not residential. The reason our building has it is because we're just on the same connection that the rest of the University has.  It's almost only used for very large networks that require extremely high speed.  Not that we're prioritized on the bandwidth...  Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 15:30, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

YAY!!!!!!!!!!!!
THANK YOU FOR ROLLBACK! Smore King  Hap py Holidays!  02:18, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

NAO
Could you temporarily restore my SSBR character articles so I can copy the format PLZ? That stuff was mad hard to think up.  Blue  Ninjakoopa  02:05, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

wing dashing
i dont think its pointless. but why bother to do that stuff if you wan just jump? what makes it so special?--tarrant1400 (talk) 10:12, 29 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Talk to Ax, he's the Pit player. Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 18:07, 2 January 2009 (UTC)

!!!My Page Is Messed Up!!! HELP!!!
Ok, so i was doing this weird thing making 0's like this

0 00 000 0000 00000 0000 000 00 0

ect.. gut now my smashwiki stuff (like search bar newest articles box and stuff), all got moved onto my page, could u help me put them back? thanks in advance

 Ssbb legend Is in!  06:05, 2 January 2009 (UTC)


 * Exactly what am I supposed to do? Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 18:09, 2 January 2009 (UTC)

Its okay, Aaron. I fixed it long before you read this.  Toon Ganondorf    (t    c)  11:54, 3 January 2009 (UTC)

I think I leaked your name....  Blue  Ninjakoopa  14:59, 3 January 2009 (UTC)
 * It's on my user page. Anyway, given all the other information there, it wouldn't be too hard to figure it out if someone really wanted to.  Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 21:10, 3 January 2009 (UTC)

Hi clarinet hawk. I dont think we've met before. Im the blue blur, and if you want a brawl sometime just say. Thanks. :)  ~Teh Blue  Blur~ ... ~You're too slow!~  18:01, 4 January 2009 (UTC)

I Feel Like an
I feel like an. I am getting on everyone's nerves. I feel horrible... By the way, I got rid of my "picture quotes" INCLUDING the old pics. (Sigh.).SapphireKirby777 (talk) 17:29, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

Category
Is there a category for Voice actors, if there isn't I would recommend creating one so that their isn't a heap of uncatogorized pages such as these ones:


 * Jay Ward

Thanks. Mystery Heff   TALK  01:45, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Give me the list of all the pages. I'm too lazy to hunt for them myself.  Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 02:03, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

I'll try and find them but I got no idea at all what I'm searching for.-- Mystery Heff   TALK  02:05, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

Don't worry I found all of them they are located here Voice actors, but there is already a category for them (Sorry for wasting your time, I only just realized).

Oh, come on
The birds didn't do anything to you! At least they weren't spam GIFs...  Blue  Ninjakoopa  04:01, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Have you ever seen Hitchcock? Those things scare the shit out of me.  Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 04:02, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Can we go to IRC and discuss your fears?  Blue  Ninjakoopa  04:08, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * It was a joke about the fears. I'm about to shut the computer and watch the end of the Fiesta Bowl and go to bed.  Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 04:13, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Okay. Enjoy your movie, and I will see you tomorrow. lol  Blue  Ninjakoopa  04:16, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * The Fiesta Bowl is a football game, champ. Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 04:37, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I know this. I watch football with my dad.  Blue  Ninjakoopa  05:02, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

Roll back
How many edits to the main space do you recomend I get before running for rollback? please reply on my talk page. Thanks.-- Mystery Heff   TALK  09:18, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Five hundred? I don't know.  It's not an edit count thing.  It's about who actually needs the tools to be effective.  Right now, you're showing me that you don't need the tools but just want to be part of some "club."  Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 16:16, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

What happened to this?
Why is it protected? I don't think someone has messed up this forum, so why the protect it so no one can edit (not to sound mean or anything)? JMBZ-12 (talk) 02:02, 7 January 2009 (UTC)
 * The page is an archive; even if it weren't protected, you're supposed to use the current version of the forum, not the archived one. --  Shadow  crest  02:04, 7 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Oh, so that's probably it. I forget >_>. JMBZ-12 (talk) 02:05, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

Bullying
I got the feeling that you singled out SapphireKirby777 about the pictoquotes thing. Many users have pictoquotes, but I'm sure that you wouldn't demand that they "get rid of them now". I personally believe that you singled him out and told him off. I am aware that you dislike pictoquotes, after reading your forum, but I believe that if seasoned contributors like Masterman or even admins like Miles can have them, why not everyone? You only told him off, not everyone else. Besides admins are not kings. What you did was just unfair.  Toon Ganondorf    (t    c) 
 * When you start an argument with an administrator, you should probably use correct grammar and non-repetitive words, so they can take you seriously.  Blue Ninjakoopa Talk 09:08, 10 January 2009 (UTC)

TG, I understand your concerns in the matter. The reason that I directed the comments at Sapphire directly was because he was making tons of pages, sub-pages, and archives of nothing but pictoquotes. I feel that the things as a whole are uncalled for, but the jury is still out about the complete issue. What he was doing, however, was flooding the recent changes and servers with repeated edits to something that policy very well may not allow. Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 20:46, 13 January 2009 (UTC)

Very well. I understand. I am sorry, I should have realised you would have had a good reason.  Toon Ganondorf    (t    c) 
 * YAV like and such as. --  Shadow  crest  00:46, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

What he did to me was understandable. I understand as well I was making tons of errors. Thanks Clarinet Hawk for warning me about this. <font face="calibri" size="3"> SapphireKirby  777  19:24, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Infinite Dimensional Cape
"Additionally, players would do well to refrain from using it in serious matches, as the glitch is highly unfair."
 * "That sentence does nothing but mark this wiki as a bunch of scrubs. If it isn't banned, you can use it. There is no cheap."

You are incorrect in thinking that this one sentence in an in-depth informative article mars all it's contributors as unskilled players/editors. It is my belief that this website should strive to be the definitive source for any and everything relating to SSB, which can be called upon by absolutely anyone, including those that have never even heard of the game. -It should be written as such. But even if you don't feel that way, this information still has merit.

You are incorrect that "There is no cheap". There are far more casual players than skilled players, and very few tournament players. -And yes, perhaps the majority those high-level players who may be users here agree with you; but they all certainly don't. You're only looking at it from one elite perspective; try and see this from the others.

I intend to continue arguing on this, so please respond; Thanks. Zixor (talk) 22:42, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Arguing over whether or not there is or is not such a thing as "cheap" is kinda missing the forest for the trees. Wikis are intended to be unbiased encyclopedias, which is to say that while they may document the existence of opinions, they should never seek promulgate opinions.  Yes, yes, this isn't Wikipedia, I know, but the notion of NPOV (neutral point of view) still holds.  Telling people that the glitch is "highly unfair" is a subjective (i.e. not neutral) analysis.  Cautioning people not to use the glitch on the basis of said analysis qualifies as promulgating an opinion.  The problem is further compounded by the fact that the above sentence treats that analysis as if it were objectively true; it states definitively that the "glitch is highly unfair."  Is there such a thing as "unfair"?  I don't know.  The very existence of multiple points of view, however, is sufficient reason not to include that sentence; it's not the place of SmashWiki to make such judgments.  I 'spose you could state that some players consider the glitch highly unfair, though it might be something of a stretch without a citation of some kind.  Oh, and I realize that this is semi-semantic, but seeing as how the aforementioned sentence offers only a single viewpoint and treats it as the definitive viewpoint, it's hypocritical to argue with CHawk on the basis that the wiki shouldn't only offer one (i.e. the "elitist") opinion.  –  Defiant Elements   +talk  00:25, 17 January 2009 (UTC)


 * Everything that DE wrote about the NPOV is good. I would have argued all of it.  Furthermore, it is unimportant if some random casual players think that a technique is cheap.  We can't prove that it is cheap, and if it isn't banned you can use it.  Period.  And when you add in the "serious match" your inherently not talking about "casual" players.  If you come up to me and say "let's play for $100, but it's not necessarily SBR rules,"  I'll use this glitch all day long to win my money.  It's not important how "unfair" it is.  As for the comment that there are more casual players than high-level and they (presumably) think this is cheap is simply argument ad populum, a logical fallacy.  Finally, if we do have to go with one group of players' opinion you provide no logic (beyond the fake logic ad populum) as to why it shouldn't be the high level players.  A baseball wiki doesn't care that Joe the Plumber thinks that a slider is a cheap pitch, it cares that Randy Johnson (in his prime) utterly dominated virtually every left-handed batter he faced using the slider.  Most left handed batters could not hit his pitches.  Period.  Was it cheap?  By your definition, yes.  Did Johnson care?  Probably, and that's why he kept throwing it.  A competitor has no obligation to "play the game the way it was meant to be played," give his/her opponent a chance, and/or make the game interesting to watch.  The only thing that matters is that s/he plays within the established letter (not necessarily spirit) of the rules.  Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 22:32, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

Alright, well: I do find it difficult understand and argue too many points at once, and this issue is becoming something of a headache for me with it's many facets; So I'll try just to address one or two of the most important issues at a time. Your writing style is perhaps a bit too intelligent for me to follow at times; but one thing seems clear: you aren't understanding this from beyond your perspective.

All I'm really trying to say in the article is that, to the majority of people, the move is clearly effective to the point that its constant and effective use could evade almost ANY attack, in addition to offensive uses. As long as it's not to fast, you can dodge anything. No other technique realistically allows for this level of evasion (by a wide [almost "infinite"] margin), and I feel that pretty much anyone would agree that the move is "broken", and less than legitimate (unfair, cheap). -I guess I just don't understand how that could really be in debate to an average player.

I definitely understand your perspective, but you have to understand that it isn't fact. This issue is absolutely NOT as cut and dry as you're presenting it.

-And please, try to keep your response simple and direct, as I'm having a hard time locking in on the important points. Zixor (talk) 23:03, 17 January 2009 (UTC)
 * OK ace, I'll put it simply: if it isn't banned, you can use it.  Guess what, this move is banned by the SBR, so for all intents and purposes it is banned in all serious matches.  But if it is not explicitly banned in a tournament, a player can use it.  I fully understand what the glitch is and what it does.  And I also understand that it is banned in SBR certified tournaments.  We banned it at the UISCS.  That's not my problem.  My problem is that we shouldn't tell people to make qualitative judgments about using things that are allowed.  A "legitimate" tactic is any tactic that isn't against the rules, even if it might seem cheap.  Go to David Sirlin's site and read his treatise Playing to Win before you continue this argument with me.  Clarinet Hawk (talk · contributions) 02:02, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

BRAWL
Do you want to brawl tomorrow? I am really bored and since you're a semi-pro I want to test my skills(if any are there) against you. If you accept this request say so in my talkpage and if you decline please say so in my talkpage. -Y462 - (Discussion •  W h o Cares? )  02:28, 18 January 2009 (UTC)